What else can happen when Guards Become Lords and Top Businessman of the Country.

Obstinate Pakistani Army has been the main reason for fueling conflict and violence in the region along with its age old dominance of politics and foreign policy.

The unique structure and circumstances only point to Pakistani obsession with set of self destructive national objectives and goals.

The front line Strategic Assets of the Rouge Army; have already set the shrill pitch of the move being against the national interests of Pakistan and its very existence.

It is yet to be seen how long people of Pakistan will allow themselves to be intimidated and fooled in to pursuing such self defeating-insular mindset and actions belonging the medieval past..

Pakistan's main concern is high tariffs that India has been using discriminately agasint Pakistan.

Both countries continued to trade with each other before Pakistan granted MFN statues to India. That the MFN status has not been negotiated to Pakistan's interest in the main stumbling block to its full implementation.

This is a fact the Indian psuedoIntellecutals on political discussion boards fail to understand but are too obsessed with PakArmy their vision is truely through a very dark and narrow tunnel unable to see the bigg picutre.

Striver,

I have requested you to stop striving for blatant obfuscation and subterfuge.

Pakistani Army is real owner of Pakistan and the eternally Back Bending Rich Feudal Chieftains only are the card board Civilian Rulers propped up to woodwind the world. Along with Mad Mullah and teeming Terrorists make the motley weird crowd Ruling Pakistan, with no one in real control.

To set things right one has to accept the hard realities and work towards a possible makeover. Unfortunately the honesty and guts have been missing.

Even friendly countries have bundle of real and perceived problem areas, which can be work out gradually, over a period of time.

Trade has to be Win-Win for both in nutshell and perhaps that may be difference of opinion and position in some areas.

It is also a well known fact that Pakistani Army has business tentacles spreading to retail, services, manufacturing and other areas.

An Army with multifarious business interests can not be a truly professional army.

Period.

Visiontunnel

You need to come out of this psuedo-intellectual-loser mode. Can you do it, for your own-sake?

Kashmiris are rightly upset at Paskitan for giving India MFN status. Kashmiris should not be betrayed.

The narcissist, avaricious leaders in the present political setup are fools who will trade Pakistan's interests away for on the cheap.

There need to be an equal trade-off on interests, give an take. This has not happened. Kashmir aught ot have been discussed at the gathering. But aquisitve minds of our leaders took the better of them.

Kashmiris recall when the Hindu Kashmiris blocked the trade route ot Muslim parts of Indian-occupied Kashmir casuing near famine. Did the world take notice? NO.

Pakistan must not betray its Kashmiri brethren.India must honour UN resolution and give Kashmiris their freedon.

Atrocities by Indian army in Kashmir:
Exhibit 1

"Young girls were now being raped systematically by entire (Indian) army units rather than by a single soldier as before. Girls are taken to soldier's camps and held naked in their tents for days on end. Many never return home....Women are strung up naked from trees and their breast lacerated with knives, as the (Indian) soldiers tell them that their breast will never give milk again to a newborn militant. Women are raped in front of their husbands and children, or paraded naked through villages and beaten on the breasts."
(The Independent, September 18, 1990)

THE WORLD MUST WAKE UP TO INDIAN ATROCITIES ON KASHMIRIES:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2mtXTwxxB2U
Prof William Wayne Baker says: I have never seen such atrocities anywhere in the world.

He interviewed an 82 year old Kashmiri woman who had been raped by 10 Indian soldiers.

He interviewed a 10 year old girl who had 40 blood transfusions

A Kashmiri man paraded in the streets and then set on fire

WHERE IS THE WORLD......DO YOU NOT SEE THE HUMAN RIGHTS VIOLATIONS OF THE WORST KIND HERE?

Striver,

I do not know what is the so called pseudo- intellectual loser mode.

But it would far more productive and reasonable for you to have courage and honesty to accept the hard realities.

Quoting few interviews of perceived or real victims in a conflict zone, do not tell the real motives, stories and sinister games played by a rouge army across the border and its self defeating goals and objectives.

You like a jingoist Pakistani in perpetual denial mode-once again indulge in blatant obfuscation and subterfuge by blaming India for plebiscite not happening in Kashmir.

When the whole world knows about intransigence and paranoia of Pakistani rulers being the real villains by not vacating the territory occupied by the Pakistani Solders disguised as tribal intruders out to claim a Muslim majority land.

Now, let us try to go over the defining historical events in Kashmir, to judge the validity and fairness of The Pakistani Narrative about Kashmir.

In August 1947, like other princely states, Kashmir also had the choice to accede to its preferred dominion - India or Pakistan, taking into account factors such as geographical contiguity and the wishes of their people.

The King of Kashmir delayed his decision, attempting to remain independent.

In their very first major foreign policy decision, the rulers of Pakistan decided to attack and take Kashmir by force. The Pakistani soldiers in the guise of tribal Pathans and mercenaries entered Kashmir on 20th October 1947.

When invaders reached outskirts of the capital Srinagar, the Maharaja had to ask India for help and finally joined India on 26th October 1947.

The agreement which ceded Jammu and Kashmir to India was signed by the Maharaja and Lord Mountbatten of Burma. The Jammu & Kashmir National Conference volunteers worked shoulder-to-shoulder with the Indian Army to drive out the invaders.

Pundit Nehru’s deep faith in effectiveness of UN, forced him to seek help of the international body in no way diluted the facts of Kashmir being part of India.

Pakistan never retreated from the forcibly occupied area, the basic precondition of the plebiscite, which could never be held. While article 370 forbids any one to buy property in Kashmir, Pakistan changed the demography of the part under its occupation, rendering possibility of a plebiscite remote.

After 1989 departure of the Russians from Afghanistan, the Pakistan army/ISI decided to push the battle hardened Jihadists in to Kashmir. That led to sharp revival of separatist forces and religious fanaticism.

Till 2001 terrorist groups in Jammu and Kashmir (J&K) have killed more than 30,000 civilians and 6000 defense personnel. The political parties have not been spared either. The National Conference has lost 205 members, Congress 49, Janta Dal 10, BJP 9, CPI (M) 5 and the Awami League 5. More than 350,000 pundits have been rendered homeless, forcing them to live as refugees in their own country. The terrorists have attacked 45 security forces’ establishments in the last year. Between 1990 and 2000, the security forces have recovered 20,365 AK rifles, 8,825 pistols, 959 UMGs, 308 sniper rifles, 615 rocket launchers, 1,687 rocket boosters, 75 LMGs, 757 assorted weapons and 25,000 kg of RDX.

The rulers of Pakistan have never shied away from their gleeful acceptance of providing support to so called Kashmir freedom fighter.He never mentioned the well-known facts that Pakistan has attacked Kashmir in 1947 which eventually ceded of India, along with further attacks in 1965, 1971 and 1999.

It might have also meant little to you that Pakistan for long, has brazenly given safe sanctuary and ample resources to dozens of terrorists, hate preachers, war lords, drug lords, plane hijackers, criminals, smugglers and killers, who are perceived as the strategic asset by a Mafioso Army,-the real owner and ruler of Pakistan.

"Bandits and criminals" have been taking advantage of militancy in Jammu and Kashmir and are raping, murdering, extorting money and using mafia practices and later blaming security forces for the crimes, says a Europe-based think tank.

In its recent report, Belgian Association for Solidarity with Jammu and Kashmir said while bandits and criminals are there in every society, in J&K, however, they are taking advantage of the troubled situation.

"They are abducting people for money, raping, murdering, extorting money, using mafia practices, etc under the cover of 'the movement'. For them this is a lucrative industry and under the present circumstances, it is easy to blame the security forces of all crimes that are committed," said the report prepared by the Belgium-based organization after visiting the state in summer this year.

During the visit, the team of the think-tank led by Paul Beersmans met a cross-section of the people including pro-Pakistan Syed Ali Shah Geelani and moderate leaders including Bilal Lone and Abdul Gani Bhat besides politicians from the mainstream political parties.

In its 17-page report, it condemned the separatist leadership for turning a blind eye to human rights violations being committed by terrorists.

http://zeenews.india.com/news/jammu-and-kashmir/terrorism-a-lucrative-industry-in-jandk_738905.html

A brilliant idea

An American Council has asked Ban Ki-moon to appoint Bishop Desmond Tutu to as head of UN effort to resolve the Kashmir issue and bring peace in the region.

Ban Ki-moon appeares to be reviving a key function of the UN: to support the will of the people.

The Council quoted Amnesty International's report of finding 2700 unmarked graves in Indian Occupied Kashmir.

This idea must be taken up by the UN and put Kashmir back on the UN agenda where it should be right now.

Countless individuals have been maimed and countless women molested and assaulted. United States, Department of State’s country report on human rights says that 8,000 to 10,000 people have involuntarily disappeared.”

STOP GENOCIDE OF KASHMIRIS.

FREE KASHMIR

Kashmiri freedom groups offered to help the Indian amry de-mine Kashmir. The Indian army refused.

Twenty-one-year old Mohammad Shabir lost his left leg in May to a mine while ploughing his land. He stepped in a pool of water which was "mine-free" just a day before.

"It was like a heavy vehicle hitting me below the knee. I went unconscious," he said.

Almost all of the 50-odd families of Terwa Daeger have one or more members who have lost a leg to landmines.

Sixty-seven-year-old Mohammad Ben, from a nearby village, was chasing his cow when he stepped on a mine.

"I tried to stop her as she was approaching a mine and stepped on one instead," Ben said.

A year after his limb was replaced, his 27-year-old son, Mohammad Hanif, also stepped on a mine.

"I told him not to go to the forest at night to relieve himself, he did and suffered," Ben said, looking apologetic.
BBC

Striver,

From the latest "The Atlantic" article about Pakistan"

"Few experts believe that Pakistan is in imminent danger of complete collapse—but the trends, as Cohen notes, are wholly negative. The government is widely considered to be among the world’s most corrupt. (President Asif Ali Zardari is himself informally known as “Mr. 10 Percent.”) Last year, Pakistan’s inflation rate hit a high of 15 percent, and the real unemployment rate was 34 percent. Some 60 percent of Pakistanis survive on less than $2 a day. Nearly a quarter of the government budget goes to the military.

In a country that has achieved only modestly in the realms of innovation, science, and education (especially in comparison with its rival, India), the Pakistani nuclear program has played an outsized role in the building of national self-esteem. And so criticism of the program is deeply wounding, and produces feelings of paranoia."

These are the unfortunate consequences of pursuing self destructive goals and objectives by the Rulers of Pakistan.

Further it is indeed strange that there have been no one with wisdom, courage and influence to make a difference by correcting the radicalized violent journey; initiated for the voracious greed and paranoia of few semi literate-blood letting tribal hawks.

changing the demographic composition...of Kashmir. It is trying to settle non-Kashmiris in the territory, laws banning purchase of land in Jammu and Kashmir by non-Kashmiris were being eroded

.....this is a a new ethnic cleansing against Muslim population of the area

..thus India is conspiring to convert the Muslim majority into a minority in the territory

was shown in Kashmir.

The 20-minute long film portrays the agony of the family of Sameer Rah, a seven-year-old boy, who was martyred during last year’s uprising.

The participants hailed the work done by the team. “We are intellectually, physically and emotionally dwarfed. We have been disfigured by historians. We need to communicate our anguish to international community utilizing the new mediums,” said Dr Altaf Hussain.

“Telling truth is an art and we have been lacking in this,” said Advocate Parvaz Imroz.

The film is directed by Shah Iffat Gazia, a third year B.Sc student, with the help of two engineering students and a freelancer photojournalist, Burhan Kinu.

.....see for yourslef..........

http://www.nowpublic.com/world/atrocities-committed-indian-forces-kashmir

see how the Indian army lies. The police is too sacred to contradict the army.

Indian army rapes mains and kills with immunity.

......on Indian atrocities.......

http://stream.aljazeera.com/story/kashmiri-protest-culture

WARNING: Contains disturbing images.

KEEP IT UP !!

Deceiptful Indian propaganda maintains that Paskitanis troops invaded Kashmir and Indian troops moved int when "invited"...

TRUTH:
According to several historian.e.g.MC Mahajan Indian troops were flown into Srinagar airport. They were met there by other Indian troops that were ALREADY THERE.

This was one of the factors that motivated Pathan tribesmen to help thier Muslim brethren.

Striver,

I am neither surprised and nor amused by show of totally hateful obfuscation and subterfuge.

I am sure you will not agree that the Ideology of Pakistan has been an essential component of hate against India and the Hindus. For the upholders of the Ideology of Pakistan, the existence of Pakistan is defined only in relation to Hindus, and hence the Hindus have to be painted as negatively as possible.

A 2005 report by the National Commission for Justice and Peace a non profit organization in Pakistan, found that Pakistan Studies textbooks in Pakistan have been used to articulate the hatred that Pakistani policy-makers have attempted to inculcate towards the Hindus. 'Vituperative animosities legitimize military and autocratic rule, nurturing a siege mentality. Pakistan Studies textbooks are an active site to represent India as a hostile neighbor' the report stated.

The story of Pakistan’s past is intentionally written to be distinct from, and often in direct contrast with, interpretations of history found in India. From the government-issued textbooks, students are taught that Hindus are backward and superstitious.' Further the report stated 'Textbooks reflect intentional obfuscation. Today’s students, citizens of Pakistan and its future leaders are the victims of these partial truths

Pakistani Textbooks by propagating concepts such as jihad, the inferiority of non-Muslims, India’s ingrained enmity with Pakistan, etc., the textbook board publications used by all government schools promote a mindset that is bigoted and obscurantist. Since there are more children studying in these schools than in madrassahs the damage done is greater.

Former military dictator Gen Zia-ul-Haq under a general drive towards Islamization, started the process of historical revisionism in earnest and exploited this initiative. 'The Pakistani establishment taught their children right from the beginning that this state was built on the basis of religion – that's why they don't have tolerance for other religions and want to wipe-out all of them

You have problem with accepting any thing coming from west, if it criticize Pakistan,

OK. Don't believe West and Indians, listen to what the present Pakistani Ambassador Hussein Haqqani also made, an otherwise well known observation : "Hostility between India and Pakistan continues; in Pakistan it serves as an important element for national identification."

Making an important remark at the end of his book, Who Killed Daniel Pearl?, the French philosopher Bernard-Henri Levy expressed this terrifying conclusion: “I assert that Pakistan is the biggest rogue of all the rogue states today. I assert that what is taking form there, between Islamabad and Karachi, is a black hole compared to which Saddam Hussein’s Baghdad was an obsolete dump.”

I am keeping the lesson short your mind does not have owrk over time to assimilate the facts here.

Questions arsie as to WHO "INVITED" THE INDIAN TROOPS to KASHMIR? WHICH KASHMIRI LEADER INVITED THEM?

WHERE THE DOCUMENTS JUSTIFYING SUCH A CLAIM? The answer is THERE ARE NONE.

Hari Singh was a Hinud ruler of Kashmiri state. He ahd lost 80% of his territory of Kashmir. At dawn 9 DC3's delivered 8tons of arms and ammunition for the Sikh soldeirs. Total number of Indian soldiers reached 100,000 men.

Hari Singh promised that once he regained control he will appoint his old friend Sheikh Abdullah as the new Prime Minister of Kashmir. This ensured that Kashmir remained in Indian control and any plebiscite if ever held would be in Indian control .i.e. no plebiscite wouold he held.

"The support of secessionist terrorism has become an integral part of Pakistan diplomacy."
-Yossef Bodansky

Extracts from two reports "Pakistan's Kashmir Strategy" a report of the Freeman Centre for Strategic studies, and "The New Islamic International" a report of the Task Force on Terrorism and Unconventional Warfare,of the House of Republican Research Committee, U.S. House of representatives, Washington D.C.

....For Islamabad the liberation of Kashmir is a sacred mission, the only task unfulfilled since Muhammed Ali Jinnah's days.

Islamabad desperately needs an external challenge for its own domestic political reasons, ranging from diversion of popular attention away from the domestic collapse to finding "something to do " for the ISI and the military rather than meddling in politics."

Meanwhile, the ISI translated its major paramilitary command into a major political force. Now there is a need for a mission use for the ISI's numerous para-military and Afghan forces, as well as an institutional interest in preserving the political clout that comes with these operations. Islamabad finds a task for the ISI's vast Pakistani and Afghan cadres previously involved in sponsoring the Jihad in Afghanistan, but who are now no longer needed, that would keep them away from domestic politics and power struggles.

In early June 1994, Commander Manzur Shah declared that the sole objective of the escalating Jihad in Kashmir is to incorporate it into Pakistan. He admitted that Indian Kashmiri Muslim leaders were assassinated or attacked in order to prevent them from reaching an agreement with the Indian government. " Wali Mohammed would not have been assassinated and the caravans of Farooq (Abdullah) and Rajesh Pilot would not have been attacked if the climate was conducive to political action"

Meanwhile, a campaign of assassinations was launched in order to eliminate the Kashmiri civic leadership that opposed the escalation of the Jihad. On June 20 1994, Islamist terrorists assassinated the Kashmiri Scholar Qazi Nissar Ahmed. He was kidnapped a night before and pressured to endorse the anti-India Jihad. He refused and was killed. A key member of the assassination was Fayaz Ahmad Mir a.k.a. Abu Bakr of Hizb-ul-Mujahideen. Ahmed was the 17th Kashmiri Muslim Scholar to be assassinated by Islamists for refusing to join the anti-India struggle.

The strategic logic of using the nuclear factor to offset any deficiencies in conventional military power has been the cornerstone of Pakistan's nuclear strategy. Recently a more assertive element was first introduced to the nuclear strategy by Islamist politicians. The overall Pakistani strategic confidence has been expressed in brinkmanship statements coming out of Islamabad since the fall of 1993. For example, Qazi Hussain Ahmad, the Jamaat-i-Islami Chief Senator, urged the Bhutto government "to declare Jihad on India to save Kashmiri Muslims from total annihilation. " There is no other way to resolve the crisis he declared. "Let us wage Jihad for Kashmir. A nuclear armed Pakistan would deter India from a wider conflict." he stressed. Thus the statement of mid February confirms that the Bhutto government has indeed adopted the strategy and policy outlined by the Islamists.

As the spring of 1995 draws near and the weather improves, the ISI is about to unleash a new cycle of terrorism and subversion. Considering the extent of the training, preparations and organizational effort invested in the Kashmiri Islamist insurgency during the last few years, it is safe to assume that fighting in Kashmir will escalate markedly in the coming year. Numerous additional highly trained and well equipped Mujahideen, many of them professional specialist forces and terrorists, will join the fighting in Kashmir and will even expand the struggle into the rest of India. They already have in place extensive stockpiles of weapons as well as large sums of money to sustain and support their Jihad. Their primary mission, however, will not be for the liberation of Kashmir but rather furthering the strategic interests of Islamabad.....

Striver,

I would like wind this futile discussion about trade spinning out to welcome India-Pakistan mud fest-thanks to your rabid views and acute delusions.

If you love to revisit history conveniently, why not go back to more than thousand years?

Perhaps you are aware of the fact that Allama Iqbal was a third generation converted Muslim from family of Hindu Kashmiri pundit.

Jinnah was also a third generation Muslim from Hindu Rajput back ground.

You must also be a sixth generation converted Muslim, with Hindu ancestry

But perhaps, you would like to believe otherwise and assume an Arab ancestry for obvious reasons.

People in today's Afghanistan, Turkey, Baluchistan, the Frontier Province, West Panjab, Bengal and in the whole of South Asia were Vedic Hindus only 1500 years ago. Kashmir was totally a Hindu area 700 years ago. These very people later became Muslims, Christians. So long they remained Hindus they were nationalists. The sound of peace and tranquillity echoed from temples and Maths. Despite having different faiths they remained together and helpful to one another. Their roots were in the Indian culture. Under the centralised rule of the Indian kings people in all these states lived a happy life. Politically, geographically, socially and culturally the region remained united in the shape of India.

Advent of Islam

But the tables were turned with the advent of Islam. It marked an end of unity, humanity, culture and nationalism. Freedom of worship, religious unity, local deiities and religious rites and capacity to think were all sacrificed on the altar of Islamic brotherhood. Forcible religious conversion, that too under the threat of the sword, rocked the nation. Refusal to accept Islam resulted in the massacre of people, destruction of temples and shrines, in burning of libraries, rape of women and sale of enslaved men belonging to the conquered society, in looting of property of non-Muslims and in encasing children in walls. These were done in the name of Islam to "please" God.

Wherever Islam spread in the world these acts of destruction took place. After all what is there in Islam ?

Islam Divides the World

Islamic social science divides the world in two parts.

1. Darul Harb: The nation of infidals (kafirs), area of war, is that place where people have not yet accepted Islam.

2. Darul Islam: Meaning that nation where people have adopted Islam. To convert the entire world into Darul Islam (area of peace) is the declared aim of Islam. Instructions have been issued for carrying out relentless struggle for achieving the establishment of the Islamic rule wherever it has not been set up yet. It means that Muslims living in non-Muslim countries will not settle in peace by cooperating with the local basic society, its culture and traditions. They will remain active in their search for establishing Darul Islam. The basic tenets of Islam do not accept any other religion. Therefore, it is considered religious to annex non-Muslim countries and then join them in the "Milat" (Muslim world).

Islam, either Death or Tax

Islam has created yet another religious division in the world - faithful (those who have faith in the Book) and faithless (those who have no faith in the Book). Christians and the Jews have been placed in the first group. Those who belonged to this group were given the right to live after paying the tax. But those who belonged to the other group (faithless) were given only two options - adoption of Islam or death.

Ancient Kashmir and Islam.....

There is influence of both early Buddhists and Hindu civilisations in Kashmir.

Rajatarangini is one of the few historical writings that has survived the pre-Islamic era.

Hindu ruler Rinchana emraced Isalm. His Islamic name was SADRUDDIN and so Islamic rule began in Kashmir in 1320AD.

The rest that you write about islam and muslims is based on:

1. your lack of knowledge of Islam. Reading popular press won't help you. Neither will COPYing PASTing ideas from other sites
2. There were many Hindu converts to Islam. Many of our leaders have either Hindu Sikh Chrisitian or Parsi backgrounds. Many are also descendants of the Msulim armies that conquered India. We are all proud of our backgrounds and out ancestors.

DID YOU KNOW GANDHI USED CALL BLACKS "KAFIRS"?

So you have had enough......

As you will have seen from this quick-fire discussion where India has failed Paskitan had failed too, where Paskitan has succeeded India has too. This is fact you guys need to accept and come out of the nationalistic blinfold that is causing you to become so prejudicial and hateful towards Pakistan.
PAKISTANIS DO NOT HATE INDIA.........now that is news for yoou guys....but then you don't know Pakistanis ................................................

Ancient Kashmir and Islam.....

There is influence of both early Buddhists and Hindu civilisations in Kashmir.

Rajatarangini is one of the few historical writings that has survived the pre-Islamic era.

Hindu ruler Rinchana emraced Isalm. His Islamic name was SADRUDDIN and so Islamic rule began in Kashmir in 1320AD.

The rest that you write about islam and muslims is based on:

1. your lack of knowledge of Islam. Reading popular press won't help you. Neither will COPYing PASTing ideas from other sites
2. There were many Hindu converts to Islam. Many of our leaders have either Hindu Sikh Chrisitian or Parsi backgrounds. Many are also descendants of the Msulim armies that conquered India. We are all proud of our backgrounds and out ancestors.

DID YOU KNOW GANDHI USED CALL BLACKS "KAFIRS"?

So you have had enough......

As you will have seen from this quick-fire discussion where India has failed Paskitan had failed too, where Paskitan has succeeded India has too. This is fact you guys need to accept and come out of the nationalistic blinfold that is causing you to become so prejudicial and hateful towards Pakistan.
PAKISTANIS DO NOT HATE INDIA.........now that is news for yoou guys....but then you don't know Pakistanis ................................................

Do have your say but don't bother trying to convince them.

The attacks are ad hominem.
You can see this through adjectives like "psuedoIntellecutals", "loser", "narcissistic" etc. etc.
You can also see their attribution of problems to an entire religious group eg. "Hindus". That is the opposite of what you are doing.

He doesn't bother to read what you write and check into his own data.
In short, don't wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig likes it.

Leave aside the religion, have a deep look at semi literate despotic kings, dictators and Army Thugs lording over mineral rich Middle East and else where in the Islamic world trying hard to live and die for the seventh century ideals and practices.

Sans liberal values, democracies and secularism they have shown acute obsessions with religious obscurantism and regressions along with hate for others.

Till the region and its teeming helplessly radicalized clergy and ruling elite allow the long overdue Renaissance, more conflicts and violence will keep the world torn and held hostage to the violence filled swash buckling barbaric values and unending tribalism.

It's amazing...everything you say and all your sources are proper, hardcore truth. And everything VisionTunnel says is propaganda and a half-truth or untruth. It's extraordinary, the mind of a brainwashed youth (it's certain that you ARE a youth, otherwise you wouldn't think what you have presented so far is anything other than total BS).

Let's get some things straight...this plebiscite you keep asking for...you can have it, once every Pakistani citizen vacates the entire Kashmir territory. Why, it's written there in the UNSC Resolution 47. VT made a point of this too. Can you please get on the phone to Mr. Zardari so that all Pakistanis can vacate Kashmir ASAP?

Don't start with the Army's persecution of people in Kashmir, because then I have to bring up the 1m+ massacred in Bangladesh by Pakistan. Any self-respecting country that did that wouldn't dare pretend to be the conscience of the region. How can a country that massacred millions (of Muslims!) even pretend to teach India on the murder of a few thousand (mostly) terrorists?

Get a sense of perspective. As long as there is even 1 Indian in India, pakistan will not get its hands on Kashmir.

P.S. It's "Indian", not "Hindoo"...India is a secular country, you know? A third of all Indian VPs and Presidents have been Muslim, the current PM is a Sikh, one of the most powerful leaders in the country is a European, Catholic woman...your "Hindoo"/"Hindustan" rubbish only stands up with with other brainwashed Pakistani radicals like you.

DUKEOFLANCASTERVI,

Thanks for your support.

It is indeed so sad that an article indo-Pak trade has degenerated in to a kind of avoidable India-Pakistan mud fest, primarily because of utter negativity, denials, obfuscations and acute jingoism displaced by most of seemingly educated

I had only expressed valid concerned about the better trade happening along with chain of relentless terror campaign by the Pakistani Military/Mullah Hawks.

While Islamabad had been reluctant to open up trade with India, Dubai had emerged as a major center for clandestine Indian exports to Pakistan.

The Pakistani government order during 3rvd week of july 2010, allowed import of an additional 14 industrial raw materials and products from India is unlikely to reduce the importance of the United Arab Emirates (UAE) as the transit point for clandestine Indian sales to Pakistan.

The Dubai route might still be cheaper for Indian exports to Pakistan, a wholesale trader in Dubai said. Indian exports to Pakistan through Dubai have grown rapidly over the years and this will continue because Pakistan has not given India MFN (most favored nation) status, he said.

Pakistan recently increased the number of items that can be imported from India to 601 from 587 earlier. But not many of them are actually imported. Many of these items are sent to Pakistan by Indian traders through Dubai with Indian and Pakistani traders working closely together here.

Tyres constitute one of Indias biggest exports to Pakistan, now covered in the additional 14 items sanctioned for direct import. The other items that Pakistani commerce minister Ishaq Dar said would be cleared for direct import include cotton and yarn, nickel cadmium batteries, cutting dies for shoes, carbon brushes, anti snake-bite venom serum, hides and skins, wood, whole chillies and lightweight steel rail. Dubai is by far the largest trading centre among the seven emirates. In 1996-97, UAE imports from India added up to about $1.7 billion, making India the fifth largest exporter to the Gulf state after China, Japan, the US and South Korea.

A large part of these were meant for re-export to Pakistan. Indian goods are also re-exported from Dubai to Iran, Saudi Arabia and the Central Asian Republics.

In 1995, Dubai imported Rs 200 crore worth of plastic and rubber products from India. Official figures say that Dubai also imported Rs 1,220 crore worth of goods labelled `textiles and articles. Many of these articles were left unnamed to cover re-export.

The re-export of Indian goods to Pakistan is done in two ways, according to a trader. Many of the Indian goods are marked actually for export to Afghanistan, but most of them never get beyond Peshawar, he said.

The other way is that they are simply stamped as products of another country, or of the UAE, and exported to Pakistan, he explained.

Dubai agents expect to continue trading in goods cleared for direct export as well because only we know the markets of both countries, the wholesaler said.

The trade route might change for goods cleared for direct export, but the traders will remain the same, he said.

The other Indian products imported into Dubai for re-export to Pakistan include engineering goods like pumps, motors and tools, automobile spare parts, consumer goods like sewing machines and bicycles, and base metals like aluminium.

India exported Rs 676 crore worth of machinery and appliances and 4.5 billion rupees worth of base metals and associated products to Dubai in 1995. The sale of Indian machinery, base metals and chemicals has been rising rapidly.

But there is growing demand in the UAE itself for imports from India. Tata buses and trucks are a common sight in the UAE; Indian textile machinery is being increasingly bought by garments factories here; and the demand for Indian consumer goods such as kitchen appliances and fans is rising. But the demand in the UAE is limited as it has a population of only 2.7 million.

India too is primarily a center for re-export of goods imported from Dubai. India imported Rs 250 crore worth of goods from Dubai in 1995 for sale in India, and another Rs 920 crore worth of goods that were marked for re-export to other countries.

The import bill of Dubai increased by 4.6 per cent in 1995. The import of goods from India the same year rose 13.5 per cent. The growth of Indian exports in 1994 from the previous year had been 3.25 per cent.

http://www.business-standard.com/india/news /uaeclandestine-route-for- indian-exports-to-pak/50233/